B Clarke
9 years ago
"robnorthwales" wrote:

Not just coal mining. Considering that the last of the Flintshire lead mines closed in the 1970s, there is almost nothing visible in terms of surface remains.
People who don't know the history of the area are quite shocked when they find out about the amount of mining and dewatering that went on. The Milwr tunnel in particular is met with general disbelief, and an attitude of "You're pulling my leg, a tunnel from the sea to Loggerheads !"



theres still some remaining in ceredigion some has gone , there still fiddling about with eu money and the ENVIRONMENT, a lot of sites are scheduled, and or SSIs which help to some extent protect them, in the 70s and 80s there were groups who went round and did emergency conservation , which cant happen now because ironically of the above legislation, some groups washed there hands of projects altogether, always finding a reason why they could not do anything, its good to see Mr Fellows has grabbed the bull by the horns working with the legislation to get things done
Ty Gwyn
9 years ago
"B Clarke" wrote:

"Graigfawr" wrote:

In south Wales the greater proportion of colliery tips were removed in the decade following the Aberfan disaster in 1966. Tip removals / landscaping from the 1980s onwards were, in comparison, more of a mopping-up exercise. The degree of public outcry in south Wales about tips following Aberfan was, understandably, enormous.

The great majority of shafts in south Wales were filled / capped by the NCB long before EU money was available, and the decision to fill major shafts was made by the NCB. By the 1970s this was such a mainstream activity of the NCB that they produced a lengthy instruction manual on how to fill and cap shafts.

Reverting to north east Wales, it has long struck me as one of the UK coalfields whose local authorities have tried the hardest (and largely succeeded) in removing almost every trace of the former mining industry and in reinventing the area as an extension of the economically prosperous Chester / Cheshire / etc region. I suspect that the Bersham Colliery shale tip is probably widely perceived in north east Wales as the last major coal mining blot on the area's landscape waiting to be removed.



the was no onus on the then NCB to clear /make safe any tips, the legislation of the time the 1954 mines and quarries act had very little to say about HAS apart from fencing old workings, the act was amended in 69 to include waste spoil and little was done till the health and safety act of 1974, it was the thatcher government that applied and got the remaining dumps removed from aberfan, along with the then minister for wales who coughed up the cash, not on health and safety reasons, but as he put it, "that they constitute a psychological, emotional danger"dump removal was not wide spread in the 70s compared with the 80s, it was more of a case of working with the FC to plant a few trees which they also did at aberfan

comparing pit closures in the 70s to the 80s is ridiculous a hundred and thirty odd closed in the seventies and 60s for very different reasons,the 60s and 70s saw pit closures because man power was lacking, relative very good prospects in other industries, close by, and the concentration on super pits not just in south wales but across the uk, the long life pits in south wales at this time were struggling to find men, and new pits and recommissioning pits was still happening, the whole sale destruction of mining in wales in the 80s was political, the men thought for there livelihoods, and there children's livelihoods , the employment prospects had dramatically changed over a decade,they could not just jump into another industry as before,




The tip`s above Aberfan,Merthyr Vale Colliery tips,were cleared by money out of the Disaster fund,No minister coughed up the money,and the money was returned many year`s later after Ron Davies fought for many year`s for this injustice to be settled.
The tip`s were cleared around the time the A470 was built.
B Clarke
9 years ago
"Ty Gwyn" wrote:

"B Clarke" wrote:

"Graigfawr" wrote:

In south Wales the greater proportion of colliery tips were removed in the decade following the Aberfan disaster in 1966. Tip removals / landscaping from the 1980s onwards were, in comparison, more of a mopping-up exercise. The degree of public outcry in south Wales about tips following Aberfan was, understandably, enormous.

The great majority of shafts in south Wales were filled / capped by the NCB long before EU money was available, and the decision to fill major shafts was made by the NCB. By the 1970s this was such a mainstream activity of the NCB that they produced a lengthy instruction manual on how to fill and cap shafts.

Reverting to north east Wales, it has long struck me as one of the UK coalfields whose local authorities have tried the hardest (and largely succeeded) in removing almost every trace of the former mining industry and in reinventing the area as an extension of the economically prosperous Chester / Cheshire / etc region. I suspect that the Bersham Colliery shale tip is probably widely perceived in north east Wales as the last major coal mining blot on the area's landscape waiting to be removed.



the was no onus on the then NCB to clear /make safe any tips, the legislation of the time the 1954 mines and quarries act had very little to say about HAS apart from fencing old workings, the act was amended in 69 to include waste spoil and little was done till the health and safety act of 1974, it was the thatcher government that applied and got the remaining dumps removed from aberfan, along with the then minister for wales who coughed up the cash, not on health and safety reasons, but as he put it, "that they constitute a psychological, emotional danger"dump removal was not wide spread in the 70s compared with the 80s, it was more of a case of working with the FC to plant a few trees which they also did at aberfan

comparing pit closures in the 70s to the 80s is ridiculous a hundred and thirty odd closed in the seventies and 60s for very different reasons,the 60s and 70s saw pit closures because man power was lacking, relative very good prospects in other industries, close by, and the concentration on super pits not just in south wales but across the uk, the long life pits in south wales at this time were struggling to find men, and new pits and recommissioning pits was still happening, the whole sale destruction of mining in wales in the 80s was political, the men thought for there livelihoods, and there children's livelihoods , the employment prospects had dramatically changed over a decade,they could not just jump into another industry as before,




The tip`s above Aberfan,Merthyr Vale Colliery tips,were cleared by money out of the Disaster fund,No minister coughed up the money,and the money was returned many year`s later after Ron Davies fought for many year`s for this injustice to be settled.
The tip`s were cleared around the time the A470 was built.



no they were not the disaster fund contributed it was the government of the day through the minister and the NCB who cleared the dump


In the Commons debate on the Inquiry Report it was asserted by the Government (on the advice of the NCB and supported by comments in the Tribunal report) that the remaining tips above Aberfan were not dangerous and did not warrant removal (estimated by the Tribunal to cost £3m), but merely required landscaping (a much cheaper option).[18] This was promptly contradicted by the local MP;[18] as Margaret Thatcher pointed out the report noted that "One may conclude that No. 5" (tip) "has been standing and is standing at a very low factor of safety." Despite the initial Government opposition, public pressure led to a decision to remove the remaining tips: the Secretary of State for Wales stressed however, that they were safe but that he knew from his contacts with the people of Aberfan "that they constitute a psychological, emotional danger".[25] If the tips were not physically dangerous, Robens saw no obligation on the NCB to pay the full cost of their removal. The government made a grant of £200,000 to the NCB towards the cost of removing the tips,[26] and under "intolerable pressure" from the government, the Trustees of the Disaster Fund agreed to contribute £150,000. At the time, the Charity Commission made no objection to this action, but it has subsequently been criticised as "unquestionably unlawful" under charity law.[27]
B Clarke
9 years ago
Merthyr Vale Colliery was closed in 1989.

In 1997 the incoming Labour government of Tony Blair returned to the Disaster Fund the £150,000 it had been induced by the Labour government of Harold Wilson to contribute towards the cost of tip removal.


In February 2007 the Welsh Assembly announced the donation of £2 million to the Aberfan Disaster Memorial Fund, in part as recompense for the money requisitioned by the government in the immediate aftermath of the disaster.
Ty Gwyn
9 years ago
no they were not the disaster fund contributed it was the government of the day through the minister and the NCB who cleared the dump

Of course it was the NCB that done the work,

Contributed under pressure ,I call it taken from grieving parents.
rufenig
9 years ago
What do you think Wrexham's steel sculpture should be called?
Hopefully a bit of people power in action.:thumbsup:
http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/what-you-think-wrexhams-steel-11260477 
simonrl
  • simonrl
  • 51% (Neutral)
  • Administration
9 years ago
How long before somebody suggests Steely McSteelface ? 😞 :curse:
my orders are to sit here and watch the world go by
B Clarke
9 years ago
exspelio
9 years ago
Its great that opinion is gathering momentum. :thumbup:

Damn sight better than that other 'tribute' in Wrexham market place which I would call 'Ouch my back has just gone' ----
Always remember, nature is in charge, get it wrong and it is you who suffers!.
legendrider
9 years ago
The best tribute to miners would be a viable and safe mining industry :(

MARK
festina lente[i]

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