skiprat
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12 years ago
Query automatically posted on North East Forum but I think it is more appropriate to Midlands, so copied here. Original query relates to Cortonwood (Monkey Island) pit.

The 1850 OS map shows no signs of mining activity close to the pushpin for Monkey Island, however there are pits closer to Cortonwood on the opposite side of Westfield Road. The pushpin for Westfield Colliery approximates to this site however there are pits on the OS to the south of Elsecar Road labelled as Westfield Pits to the south east at SE 41512 00315.

Additionally to the west of Westfield Pits, are a further two sites marked as "Coal Pit Shaft" and "Old Coal Pit". These are about 400m east of the pushpin for Counting Houses Pit where there is no sign of mining activity on the 1850 OS.

Can anybody add clarity to the correct identity of these sites?

Skiprat
LeeW
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12 years ago
http://www.streetmap.co.uk/map.srf?x=441200&y=400800&z=4&sv=441200,400800&st=OSGrid&lu=N&tl=~&ar=y&bi=~&mapp=map.srf&searchp=ids.srf 

OS maps shows a spoil mound

The Westfield Colliery referred to here is in the correct location (i.e. correct NGR).
It is not uncommon to have the same or similar names for mines, and sometimes the mine may move location. The pits to the south of Elsecar Road are probably Westfield Pits.

Colliery sites also may change names - if you look at Willow Main on the old maps you will see it was originally called Cortonwood.

All the 'old pits' might not have a known name.

Also old maps is not the only source of information for locating old mines. The recorded coal mine shafts / adits are shown on the Coal Authority interactive viewer.

It has taken some effort to get the correct NGRs for the sites. I use the NGR if I want to find something again. The grid references are generally correct and they DO NOT want changing. If there are any obvious errors then ask me and I will check the location and edit if needed.

I went in a mine once.... it was dark and scary..... full of weirdos


When do I get my soapbox, I need to rant on about some b***cks
skiprat
  • skiprat
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12 years ago
I didn't intend to imply that anything needed changing, I'm just trying to get my head around some of the sometimes slightly conflicting information from different sources.

I'm aware that the OS wasn't always accurate which is a great shame as it is so accessible. The Mining Authority interactive viewer shows a forest of sites in this area but no names - is there a way to put more data to their references?
Skiprat
christwigg
12 years ago
I found this article about a fire in 1904 if anyone missed me adding it at the time.

http://www.aditnow.co.uk/documents/Cortonwood-Colliery-Coal-Mine/Cortonwood-Colliery-December-1904.pdf 
pwhole
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12 years ago
Does anyone know the origin of the name 'Monkey Island'? The only other old ref I have for the name is a track by the 13th Floor Elevators!

I've been having some similar issues with old coal mines around the west of Sheffield - I keep finding likely sites but there's zero info, and even on the old OS maps 'Old Coal Pit' is all that's likely to be found.

I do have a doozy of a site which is listed on the CA map, and which consists of extensive sandstone/gritstone hillocks, trackways and one or two possible collapsed shafts or other circular structures. Across the road there seems to be the well-preserved remains of a gin circle platform with shaft adjacent.

If it were Derbyshire, and limestone, it would be a well-known mine site. However, I haven't managed to find anyone who knows about this one. My knowledge of coal-mining history is almost zero though, so it's likely to be my ignorance as much as unavailable data. Sending you a PM Lee...
Morlock
12 years ago
christwigg
12 years ago
Theres a Monkey Island near Windsor with a lot of history.
http://monkeyisland.co.uk/live/history 

By 1840, the Pavilion had become a riverside inn, welcoming guests via a ferry that docked on the island’s south bank. The island began to attract attention, and was mentioned in a variety of publications that mused over happenings and sights along the Thames.

By the time Mrs Plummer was running the hotel from the late 1800s to 1910, the island had already become a fashionable spot, thanks in part to Edward VII and Queen Alexandra taking tea on the lawns
pwhole
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12 years ago
Interesting. I know it's heading slightly off-topic, but I also found this from a marine site:

Quote:

The term “monkey island” refers to a place on the ship which is located at the top most accessible height. Technically, it is a deck located directly above the navigating bridge of the ship. It is also referred to as the flying bridge on top of a pilothouse or chart house, and also as the ship’s upper bridge. Sailors would use this place to perform solar and stellar observations.

During the ancient time, when ship used to have masts and sails, the monkey island was also supposed to be located about 3/4th way up the main mast on few ships.

Origin of the term “Monkey Island”

There is no solid evidence or proof to back the origin of the term “monkey island”; however, there are a few theories that believed to be the reason behind the usage.

Theory 1

According to this theory, some people believe that as the money island was located at the top of the main mast of sailing ships, sailors had to scramble up the ship’s rigging to free or repair the sails and rigging or to keep a lookout for icebergs , reefs, or land. Because the sailors had to climb as the monkeys do, this topmost place was termed as Monkey Island.

Theory 2

According to this theory, it is believed that in the ancient days, cannon balls were stored aboard ships in a brass frame or trays called “monkey”. During extreme cold climatic condition, the brass trays would contract and spill the cannon balls.

Hence, a humorous reference was established that the climate was cold enough to freeze the balls of a brass monkey. However, this theory is hardly believed to be true because of a number of reasons:

1.There is no evidence found that such “deck” place on the ship was named as a “monkey”
2.The rate of contraction of the brass frame cannot so fast as to cause the mentioned effect
3.According to the past records, cannon balls were not stored on the deck except during a battle. The deck was kept as clear as possible
4.Practically it is not possible to store cannon balls at such height as during heavy rolling and pitching, the cannon balls would fall off causing harm to the ship and its crew

Though there is no concrete theory to back the origin of Monkey Island, the term is still extensively used even on modern ships.

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