It's been a while since I last went into Mandale mine, so when some friends suggested having a look in I though "yeah, why not?". My previous experience of Mandale was that it was wet, and going upstream in the sough would most likely involve water to mid-thigh. Going on this, I chucked my wetsuit bottoms and a fleece top in the car instead of the furry, and some other members of the party turned up with full wetsuits.

having headed up Lathkill dale to the engine house ruins, we opened up the gate to the incline with the usual Derbyshire key and headed downhill. The incline is now very rough due to bits having dropped off the roof over the years, but back in the 1840s it was railed for tramming, and went below the present sough level. At the incline foot, where you normally meet water, there was none, and a look into the sough confirmed there was nothing more than the occasional puddle. Although I'd been told the sough does sometimes dry up this is the first time I've ever seen it do this!

So, the way on upstream was much easier than expected albeit much sweatier for those in neoprene. We passed through the large stope and crawled through to the flooded stopes, where I've previously stopped as the way on required swimming but the drop in water levels meant that with one easy and one difficult traverse, you could get on into the next section of the sough.

There's a lot of stal in the next section, including one very nice bit where it's run over herringbone arching, much like that in Spinney level. There are also covered stone drains in the floor in another section, though why is not apparent. Eventually, the sough opens out in the chamber of Mandale forefield shaft, where a stream from the upper sough runs into the shaft. Unfortunately, this was a bit smelly due to a) a dead rabbit floating in the water of the shaft and b) what looks suspiciously like sewage in the flow from the upper sough. I didn't go into the final section as it just leads to a collapse but some of my colleagues did, I hope they soak their wellies in bleach!

This is the limit of what's explorable in Mandale now but makes for a good short trip, plus the nearest pub (the Lathkill Hotel in Over Haddon) has a fine selection of ales for the after-trip thirst quencher. As mentioned, access is with a Derbyshire key and is open to anyone with BCA cover.

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AR - If the water table is as low as you say in Mandale, perhaps Greensward pumps are also accessible!

There's quite a few places potentially accessible at the moment, Greensward, the sump at Red House, Whale sough, etc. it's just finding time to do them all!
I will be dropping into Maury sough shortly to see if that's now passable though...

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Has the low water level anything to do with the river works upstream? Are they not trying to keep water in the river and out of the sough?

The troublesome sough is actually Lathkilldale sough, which is the one which runs under Bateman's house and the river itself and is about 50ft lower than Mandale sough. This was sealed on the upstream side so that the water would flood the workings behind it and keep the river where it's meant to be!

Mandale sough's water is mostly coming from the ground well to the north of the valley, whilst the main sources for the river are further to the west

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It would appear that the water levels all over Derbyshire are low at the moment, including the rivers. I have friends who are fishermen & they keep me informed as to the levels, and recently they say the waters are all very low & very clear, ie not much silt, although they are not catching much because of it. Some of the feeder brooks are dry.

It has given us the oportunity to visit some of the larger soughs after such a wet period which kept us out of places nearly all last year. So make the most of it whilst you can, I'm sure it will change again pretty soon.

Long time since I have been in Mandale, around the mid 80's I think, though I don't recall needing a wetsuit at all in those days, shame the blockage after the shaft is still there though.

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I've often thought a Mandale trip would be good. Might have to have a look when i'm next nearby.

Despite the apparent poor summer, levels in the reservoirs and feeders are very low here on the western edge of the Peak Park.

The canal feeder reservoir of Toddbrook is dramatically low. Going over to Longnor last night noticed the Errwood was low too, couldn't quite see Fernilee.

The most noticeable feature this summer to me has been the predominantly easterly wind, it tends to be a dryer cooler wind as opposed to the wet warmer westerlies. Perhaps its just me now I'm living at nearly 300m :blink:
The moorland heather also seemed to take a while to bloom and it was over in a very short time. Sunshine and rain have been in short supply. Yet to the NW, W & SW of us I've watched the rain being dumped on the Cheshire Plain & Manchester. You can see the privileged position we live in here http://www.toadstone.com/biglow/ 

So I suppose these conditions may explain why the ground levels are lower.

Do Youlgreave water get their water from Mandale Mine, if they do looks like they could be in trouble if the water continues to drop !!!!

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Hi minerat - From memory, Youlgreave get their water supply from a private water works at the top of Bradford Dale (my favourite Derbyshire Dale, small but so pretty). A while ago there was something in the "Derbyshire Times" about them getting worried because of Hillcarr sough having become blocked and the village getting flooded Will try and find it as I sent a link to an old caving friend. - I've now found the link it was mid August 2008 but can't now locate the site!

Trust you are well, as you've been quiet on the website recently - busy in Ireland or frantically writing?

Do Youlgreave water get their water from Mandale Mine, if they do looks like they could be in trouble if the water continues to drop !!!!

Youlgreave uses Mawstone mine as a water source, which being connected to the Hillcarr-Alport system would take quite a serious drop in levels to run dry!

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The report about the Youlgreave Private Water Company getting concerned about Hillcarr sough getting blocked and backfilling appeared in the Derbyshire Times in August, 2008. The Water Company said that the water had backed up Mawstone mine's main shaft by 53 feet and they were concerned about flooding in Youlgreave! - considering that Youlgreave sits on high ground above Bradford Dale and looks down into it I think this was a bit of exaggeration in the news article. I've tried archieving the Derbyshire Times to retrieve the article and if/when I'm successful will email to you.

Incidently there was a pumping house at the very top of Bradford Dale where the track came down from Middleton by Youlgreave, this was to do with the private water supply to the village, but when we were exploring in the area (at the time of the Winster Earth Tremors - February, 1952) it was disconnected, I don't know for what reason.

We searched many awhile looking for the level called "Nellie Long Arm" that Nellie Kirkham said Mawstone miners claimed they exited from after working at Mawstone Mine. It was supposed to be located somewhere on the left bank of the River Bradford up stream from the stepping stones, but we never found it.

When we explored Hillcarr sough from the "tail" in July, 1962 (see my write-up in PDMHS Bulletin) there was quite a bad fall blocking the sough. L. Hurt (my old caving friend) did a lot of exploration thereafter and got past that blockage
and he did a very good write-up on it. I deposited a copy of it with my records now with the Derbyshire Record Office.

I find the history of the whole area around Hillcarr sough and those soughs draining into it from the numerous mines in the area fasinating.

If Youlgreave is thought to be at risk of flooding, where does that leave Alport? (other than under a hundred feet of water :lol: ) The press can really get daft about some things, although credit where credit's due, the DT was quite measured and reasonable when it reported the recent rescue from Old Millclose.

Jim R has mentioned there allegedly being "back doors" to both Mawstone and Long Rake from the top end of the dale, though I've never been and looked seriously myself when the vegetation's down....

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Regarding Sougher’s mention of Nellie Long Arm Mine in Bradford Dale, I might be able to help a bit. During the 1960s, I was told of this by old Mr. Wright who had been one of the rescuers in the Mawstone Mine Disaster. He lived at the bottom of Bankside, just below my sister’s cottage.

According to Mr. Wright, Nellie Long Arm was a level at the side of the path along the Bradford Dale valley floor 10 yards before the first dam upstream of the clapper bridge at the bottom of Holywell Lane. This is at altitude c.500 feet and approx. grid ref 205.639.

According to my rough survey made in about 1965, it is a passage about 6 feet high by 2 feet wide at about 110º mag. After some 50 feet, there was a collapse and the direct continuation was very difficult to enter but after a further 75 feet it ended naturally anyway. At the collapse, a crawl led into a similar parallel passage on the right. This ended when about 375 feet in at the foot of a collapsed shaft but it was too much for us to dig. There were also some flooded workings in its floor. The vein was not important and it does not seem to be marked on either the barmaster’s map or on the map in Jim Rieuwerts’ book.

Thanks for this info, I think I know the level you're referring to and I'll have to go for a look in at some point....

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