A sad bit of mining vandalism· Page 2

Tamarmole
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

"staffordshirechina" wrote:
One thing that needs remembering is that in 1972 a lot of our modern thoughts on preservation and ethics were not around.

A good point well made; ethics or what constitutes "best practice" are/is not fixed. One should not judge what a previous generation did in the light of a current ethical stand point.

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#22

If they were so concerned about it , why not get people who know what they are doing to dismantle it properly
instead of hacking it to bits like a couple of Gypos ?(i mean look at the state of that cut (like a dogs dick) springs to mind
What right did they have anyway to make such a decision on the rest of the "underground communities" behalf ?

.
I wonder if he also removed this ? (pic from this site)

http://www.aditnow.co.uk/cache/Balls-Green-Limestone-Quarry-User-Album/Balls-Green-Limestone-Quarry-User-Album-53757.jpg

Tamarmole
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#23

"Aditaddict" wrote:
If they were so concerned about it , why not get people who know what they are doing to dismantle it properly
instead of hacking it to bits like a couple of Gypos ?(i mean look at the state of that cut (like a dogs dick) springs to mind
What right did they have anyway to make such a decision on the rest of the "underground communities" behalf ?

.
I wonder if he also removed this ? (pic from this site)

http://www.aditnow.co.uk/cache/Balls-Green-Limestone-Quarry-User-Album/Balls-Green-Limestone-Quarry-User-Album-53757.jpg

I imagine what they did was to salvage any castings or pressings such as the end trunion which matey is hacking out in the photo. The skip body, which is probably 1/8th sheet, will be ditched and a replica fabricated with new sheet using the salvaged parts.

rikj
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#24

"Tamarmole" wrote:

I imagine what they did was to salvage any castings or pressings such as the end trunion which matey is hacking out in the photo. The skip body, which is probably 1/8th sheet, will be ditched and a replica fabricated with new sheet using the salvaged parts.

Now then, looks like you are spot on with that. Here's a photo from May 2013:

http://stroudvalleysproject.org/index.php/gallery/lower-balls-green-mine-tour-may-2013# !Lower_Balls_Green_Mine____John_Ockham._Reflex_Designs_2013__12_

seems this is what's left. I was looking at it and wondering if it was another wagon, but I'd say that hole - and other features - match up pretty well.

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#25

"rikj" wrote:

"Tamarmole" wrote:

I imagine what they did was to salvage any castings or pressings such as the end trunion which matey is hacking out in the photo. The skip body, which is probably 1/8th sheet, will be ditched and a replica fabricated with new sheet using the salvaged parts.

Now then, looks like you are spot on with that. Here's a photo from May 2013:

http://stroudvalleysproject.org/index.php/gallery/lower-balls-green-mine-tour-may-2013# !Lower_Balls_Green_Mine____John_Ockham._Reflex_Designs_2013__12_

seems this is what's left. I was looking at it and wondering if it was another wagon, but I'd say that hole - and other features - match up pretty well.

It's funny that there is no photos of such a large artifact as a crane

mistericeman
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#26

As i posted on the thread on M.E. It really is sickening that someone has done this ...let alone under the mantle of having "permission"
The bloody thing should have been left as it was where it was END OF,
possibly a slightly different case had it been in danger of being lost ...ThOUGH as time goes on i am more inclined to think that even in that case artifacts should be left as once removed all context is lost (possibly biased after seeing so many parts removed from the last resting places of downed WWII airwrecks and displayed out of context in folks collections)

I do wonder about the motivations for the destruction of this wagon as the chap involved seems to be heavily involved in NG railway preservation ...

Wonder IF he is on Facebook :angel:

scooptram
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#27

thing is if that pic is of the wagon after hes removed parts the main part as in the chassis and wheels have been left behind so what was the point they have just cut up a good tipper :curse:

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#28

There is obviously some sort of group that runs visits down this mine , has anyone asked them if permission was granted ?
i cannot see them wanting some tosser wrecking one of the best artifacts they had to show people
also if there are dangerous roof falls in that area what are they doing taking members of the public into it ?
For what its worth i think he took them to patch up some sort of railway related item as that seems to be his interest
he doesn't seem to be into underground as he wasn't wearing a helmet, he can't have been that worried about roof falls

Dark Prince
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#29

As i understand it there is/was a local chap who seemed to run trips into Balls Green. I'm surprised this has only come to light now, a year down the line. Seems the only bit they were after was the hitch bit and some of the frame.

jaiyls
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#30

...preservation HOW F---IN DOO!

Have you got any blocks boy?

ICLOK
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#31

I'm quite staggered by this... Judging by the pic from May 13 the wagon is still there apart from the damage this guy has caused... looks to me like he started this and then realised it was a bit too much of an elephant to eat... Wonder why he stopped.. was he told to per chance?
And its def not the last one as there is another in a quarry not 8 miles from here, the body is seperated from the base and a wheelset is off but its all there in the under growth and judging by this thread there it will stay...

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh Creeper!!!!!

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#32

I wandered into a quarry up in the lakes and there was a large stack of those double bull nosed chassis along the road side
with a lot of other equipment
didn't stay to long though as there were people working there

Roger the Cat
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#33

I fell doubly sad about this as I seemed to have completely missed the import of this thread until today and I live 3 miles from Nailsworth and would have liked to have at least been involved with the Stroud Valleys Group and their tour. Access to the mines is a closely guarded secret and official access is a bit of a red-letter day and knowing the right people counts. Balls Green had some interesting artefacts including, I believe 2 cranes and I understood that the collapse destroyed one of them. I was told that the mine was very unstable, but not unstable enough to prevent a party of 12+ entering, apparently. Isn't it interesting that despite all the secrecy and hoo-ha, Buffalo Bill was allowed in with his cutter.

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#34

I would really like to know if the crane is still there
in the picture (i borrowed from this site ) you can see the destroyed crane behind the complete one
My point was that all the photos taken by the "party of twelve"
this year , not one picture of what should have been the most interesting artifact The crane . which suggests to me it's no longer there

royfellows
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#35

"Roger the Cat" wrote:
official access is a bit of a red-letter day and knowing the right people counts.

Off thread comment for me to make but I have to say BIG OUCH.
This is just the thing that gets a lot of peoples hackles up.

My avatar is a poor likeness.

ttxela
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#36

"Aditaddict" wrote:
I would really like to know if the crane is still there
in the picture (i borrowed from this site ) you can see the destroyed crane behind the complete one
My point was that all the photos taken by the "party of twelve"
this year , not one picture of what should have been the most interesting artifact The crane . which suggests to me it's no longer there

I'm not sure I remember a crane from the 2010 NAMHO trip :confused: I've looked through my photos and there is no picture of a crane despite being in "take pictures of everything" mode.

I do have a picture of the other squashed wagon though

🔗Personal-Album-259-Image-90413[linkphoto]Personal-Album-259-Image-90413[/linkphoto][/link]

I remember there being a winch and lots of stacked blocks and have photos of these. - No crane though?

Aditaddict
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#37

Sorry to keep nicking someone else's photo but this was taken in 2010

AR
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#38

"ICLOK" wrote:
I'm quite staggered by this... Judging by the pic from May 13 the wagon is still there apart from the damage this guy has caused... looks to me like he started this and then realised it was a bit too much of an elephant to eat... Wonder why he stopped.. was he told to per chance?
And its def not the last one as there is another in a quarry not 8 miles from here, the body is seperated from the base and a wheelset is off but its all there in the under growth and judging by this thread there it will stay...

Equally upsetting is that the photos of this happening were tagged as industrial archaeology. If chopping bits out of an intact artefact so someone can add those bits to a replica for his own collection is industrial archaeology, I think I'll take up something more socially acceptable, like shooting badgers.....

As for that other wagon, I think I know the one you mean, sat at the side of an incline and given the working dates of the quarry, very likely WD surplus.

Follow the horses, Johnny my laddie, follow the horses canny lad-oh!

ttxela
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#39

"Aditaddict" wrote:
Sorry to keep nicking someone else's photo but this was taken in 2010

I see the album is just headed Balls Green, I wonder if the crane is in Upper Balls Green? The Wagon is in question being in lower Balls Green?

I'm pretty sure there was no crane in Lower Balls Green in 2010.

exspelio
50.2% (Neutral)
Newbie

11 years ago

#40

Sorry if I come over naive and uneducated in these matters, but what is the difference between this tub and the "Jubilees" we used to use? ( a picture comparison would be nice).

Also, does anyone know the date of the crane pictured, it appears to be in remarkably fine condition.

Always remember, nature is in charge, get it wrong and it is you who suffers!.