I have today received notification from a firm called "The Horizon Press" at Ashbourne, Derbyshire that the third volume of Jim's work on the drainage of the Derbyshire lead field entitled "Lead Mining in Derbyshire - History: Development & Drainage - 3. Winster to The Via Gellia" is to be published this month at a cost of £25.00. Notes say "that the length will be similar to Volume 2 (my comment - it contained 141 pages) and will include 8 pp of colour images, chiefly supplied by the well known underground photographer Paul Deakin".

If you wish to purchase a copy or become a subscribed purchaser, for further details please contact:-

The Horizon Press, The Oaks, Moor Farm West, Ashbourne. DE6 1 HD.

Incidently would this be the old Landmark publishing firm under a new name? The reason I comment thus is that copies of "Lead Mining in Derbyshire Volume 1" and "Lead Mining in Derbyshire Volume 2" by the same author are offered for sale by The Horizon Press at a cost of £25.00 each.

I have ordered my copy and look forward to reading the book.

Good news that this excellent three vol set is complete.

Sounds as if Landmark Press may have metamorphosed into Horizon Press? Does anyone know if Horizon is connected with Landmark?

Landmark's website had been down for over a year and there were all the signs of a great change being in the air. Incidentlaly, Landmark was a lineal descendant of Moorland, the 1970s-80s industrial archaeology publisher, also Buxton based - I seem to recall being told that some of the same players were incolved in both publishing houses. Both Moorland and Landmark appear to have over-extended their range of titles and experienced difficulties.

Yes, it is another John Robey reincarnation but we still get the books so who cares!

Wasn't John involved in Moorland Books but not Landmark! Last news I had of him was that he'd turned his attention to clocks away from books. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Come to think of it you are right. It will be a Lindsey Porter reincarnation.

I've had the same flyer, so I think it's all the subscribers to vol 1& 2 who'll have got it. It is Lindsey Porter behind the new press, and you're right Sougher, John Robey isn't really involved with mines and IA these days.

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Thanks for that information folks!

Graigfawr - just in case you aren't aware, Jim has a 4th volume in the pipeline - yet to be published - covering the area south of the Via Gellia* (i.e. south of the area described in Vol. 3) which will then complete the series. I'm looking forward to this book being published, and then we'll have a very detailed history of the Derbyshire lead mining soughs. Add also to these books Jim's original 1987 limited publication (200 copies) "History & Gazetteer of the Lead Mine Soughs of Derbyshire" and we will have a very comprehensive source of sough information (not forgetting also Nellie Kirkham's many "sough" articles which appeared in various journals and caving club publications!).

Incidently a friend has made me very curious by telling me about very early coal mining soughs that were driven in the Notts/Derbyshire coalfield around the same time as the early soughs in the Derbyshire leadfield (17th century), n.b. the earliest recorded sough in the "King's Field" being the one driven to the Gang Mines at Wirksworth by Sir Cornelius Vermuyden (the Dutch Engineer responsible for drainage in the Fens and who also reclaimed Canvey Island - a most interesting character) between 1631 and 1651, but this seems to have been predated by an earlier coalmine sough at Wollaton which appears to have been driven before the Dissolution of the Monastries (1537). This has really intrigued me, as I've only ever read a brief reference to a sough draining a coal mine (I think it was about Wollaton sough and was referred to on AN's Forum but I can't find it). I didn't realise that there were many of them, so if anyone has information on this type of drainage in the coalfields I'd love to read about it (perhaps on a separate forum topic), as I'm sure other people on AN would too.

*p.s.Off topic - Have you ever heard of a material called Viyella? It received it's name from a corruption of the name of the road (the Via Gellia A5012 - recently named as the second most dangerous accident road in the UK, the Buxton/Macclesfield road over the "Cat and Fiddle" being the number one most dangerous road!) on which the Mill stood, where the firm Hollins and Company manufactured it in 1890. This road was the Cromford/Newhaven toll road opened in 1804 which followed the rough road that Sir John Gell had constructed in the 17th century to transport his lead ore from his lead mines in the Private Liberty of Griffe Grange down to Cromford. It is a very pretty road that follows the bottom of the valley through steep wooded hillsides (which once were denuded of the trees for use as fuel for smelting the lead ore). To view old photographs of the Via Gellia and also other old views of the area around Wirksworth please visit John Palmer's excellent website as follows:-

http://www.wirksworth.org.uk/X203.htm  and
http://www.wirksworth.org.uk/oldfotos.htm 

Enjoy
🙂

Just off the top of my head, I think there might be a snippet in Jim's glossary book about where the early coal mine sough was, or at least where he'd got the reference from. I've been meaning to speak to Jim about other matters anyway so I'll try and remember to ask him. I know there are several soughs that drain the coal mines of the western moors but mostly of 18th/19th century date from what I remember of the details.

Vol.4 will also have the additions and corrections in it, plus judging by the flyer he's been able to get access to some more early material in the form of the Vernon family papers which I'm guessing are now the property of the Dukes of Rutland which I'll be interested to see.

On a somewhat related note, I saw John Beck last week and publication of the updated "Caves of the Peak District" is now going ahead, and true to form, now the manuscript has gone off for production there's a dig broken through into new cave..... :lol:

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Good news, and it's been a while and I'll most likely be getting vol4

To sougher re Wollaton Sough
I've had a paper (see links below) in my personal files for a while now, the discussion on AN was a few years ago

http://www.aditnow.co.uk/documents/Personal-Album-176/Wollaton-Lenton-Sough-Pages1-2.pdf 

http://www.aditnow.co.uk/documents/Personal-Album-176/Wollaton-Lenton-Sough-Rest-of-pages.pdf 

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Thanks for the information. The previous discussion on AN forum was entitled "Sough Linings" and it was started on 16/04/2009.

Graigfawr - just in case you aren't aware, Jim has a 4th volume in the pipeline - yet to be published - covering the area south of the Via Gellia* (i.e. south of the area described in Vol. 3) which will then complete the series.
🙂

Sougher - I hyadn't realised there was a fourth vol of this magnum opus intended - many thanks for the tip-off!

On a somewhat related note, I saw John Beck last week and publication of the updated "Caves of the Peak District" is now going ahead, and true to form, now the manuscript has gone off for production there's a dig broken through into new cave..... :lol:

Fantastic! When can we buy one?

I've no idea about release date but I'm guessing it'll be before the year is out - I'm sure John Beck will make an announcement on UK Caving when it's getting close.

EDIT - just seen Jenny Pott's post on UKC, sounds like the recent discoveries will be going in as last-minute additions. If I can beg/borrow/steal a 100m rope in the near future I might be able to cause an amendment to it too....

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Dear Sougher :offtopic: I know... but I might as well own up as your 'friend' on the coal soughs thing!! I was well flippin surprised to find Soughs on said plan by Mr Twigg of Coal workings in Ripley (drawn by him in 1827) that I told you about. I was truly amazed that there were no less than 5 maybe 6 in Ripley one of which outfalls two fields away from my home near Hammersmith, one that outfalls at Peasehill, one that that outfalls at Hammersmith and one at Hartshay (maybe 2 there) and an extra long one outfalling on the banks of the river Amber at Buckland Hollow draining the Heage pits.... three of these are clearly labelled as Soughs, the others as drainage levels. Bokey Sough which we talked about as I was trying to find it (Bl**dy nettles) even carries a note on the plan stating it was ancient as at 1802 :thumbsup: You will understand I cannot put up the plan on here as that would breach the trust of the owner....
The other fascinating facts off this plan are that the site of Ripleys first Whimsey pit was sunk in 1702 and that there are at least 2 engine pits near Greenwich of which one is recorded as being in operation in 1790.... this as I have explained Sougher has somewhat changed my whole view of my home town... add in the Coopergate engine Pit in South Ripley and we great evidence evidence of how the early coal fields were drained. I think the engine pits were for pumping as these are shown only as being sunk onto drainage levels that don't have an outfall or were they needed to lift water to the sough as with Coopergate.... Fascinating stuff...I feel a book coming on :lol: Speak later 🙂

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Gis a shout Adam My 101 M. is available! (where 😉 ?)
O. G.

Gis a shout Adam My 101 M. is available! (where 😉 ?)
O. G.

I'll be in touch next week about gate installation and I'll talk to you then about this one - If SteveT's back on shore I'd like to get him and TallMark involved too.

ICLOK - you've got me quite intrigued now with some of what you're talking about, since I've already gone way :offtopic: I'll carry on....
I've got quite interested in early horse engines of late, particularly the cog and rung gin after a chance find on Greensward rake followed by visits to the few known C&R gin sites in the Peak. Do you have any evidence for whether these gins were baling to sough level with a kibble, or whether a horse-driven rag and chain pump was being used?

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AR sorry for the late response. I'm afraid I don't. Evidence is scant on this... I certainly cannot find evidence this end of the peak for such pumping. The coal maps/plans I have show pumping to u/g drainage levels (no sough mouths) via engine shafts to drainage, I know some were fire engines.... In this area I have looked for the circles and earthworks on the old/ancient colliery sites but sadly without digging I don't think such physicsal evidence exists. As for documentary evidence I may know a man who can help but he is on hols at the moment... he would find this fascinating. I will drop him a line and see what he knows.
Regs IC

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Thanks for that ICLOK, the evidence would be relatively subtle and the only colliery sites such evidence has survived on that I know of are the ones on the western moors of the Peak. There's a definite cog and rung gin site at Thatch Marsh colliery on Axe Edge, I've got photos of it showing the now-collapsed off-centre shaft within an embanked horse walk which I'll post later - thisd particular shaft was later re-used as a firehouse shaft which may be why it's in fairly good condition, the foundations of the firehouse and part of the flue are still visible.

You don't have to dig to identify a site, the critical factors to identify a cog and rung gin are a circular platform (or enough remaining to suggest one) with the shaft off-set from the centre within it. The best example I've seen on a lead mine even has hints of hollowing on the line of the horse walk. If your friend does know of any sites where there is anything like this I'd be most interested to know, feel free to pass my email address on! :flowers:

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I am familiar with horse whim arrangements... but its finding sites around here that date back that far.. best bet around here is Pentrich ... lots of surface land disturbance relating to coal mining and I will def go and see if any such formations have survived... Spoken to my friend Bob and he is unaware of any surviving sites this side of Peak. There are some refs he already gave me which I will dig out of his text to me re pumping by rag and chain etc.
I'll go back and have a look at some of the field and earth works at the older sites and see if a longer look reveals anything.

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