Graigfawr
  • Graigfawr
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10 years ago
http://ukcaving.com/board/index.php?topic=17777.0;topicseen 

I'm posting this in a general thread rather than in a Northern thread as the liklihood of earthquakes affecting mines is quite high and can apply to any part of the UK.

The thread on UKcaving mentions some changes in Alderley Edge Mines as being potentially attributable to an earthquake. Some changes I noted in mid Wales mines in the 1980s and 1990s were also potentially attributable to earthquakes.

Its a topic that its worth mine explorers being aware of.
RJV
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10 years ago
I think that given the parlous state of a vast proportion of abandoned mine workings, I'd personally be wary of any attempt to attribute a collapse or rock fall to a seismic event unless somebody had been there to witness or otherwise record it and most specifically, the precise time it occurred.
lozz
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10 years ago
It wouldn't take much to shake a killer slab of a hanging wall.

Lozz.
Ty Gwyn
10 years ago
Of all the tremors that have occured in the UK in the last 100 yrs or so,have there been any records that showed effects on Working Mines?
RJV
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10 years ago
"lozz" wrote:

It wouldn't take much to shake a killer slab of a hanging wall.


That's my point really.

These places are collapsing around us, quite literally at times, so how do you confidently link a collapse to an earthquake if you can't accurately link the timings?
lozz
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10 years ago
I have vague memory of a tremor when I was at South Crofty in the 70's.

It would be difficult to pin a rock fall on an earthquake/tremor unless it was witnessed but I would say rocks would fall in those circumstances, anyone who has drilled a hole in a large slab with a fault on a hanging wall will know what I mean.

Lozz.
sinker
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10 years ago
@ Thursday Nighters: Remember the double quake late at night or early hours of the morning in Cwmorthin a couple of years back? It was extremely spooky, but not immediately obvious that it was a quake, although it certainly didn't sound like a rockfall. It was only when we heard about the quakes on the news the following morning that we put two and two together! 🙂
Back on topic: I can't say that I noticed any damage caused?
Yma O Hyd....
Manicminer
10 years ago
I was part of a team that had an exploration license on Clogau a number of years ago and we used to go underground there every weekend. We had 3 earthquakes during that time and on all three occasions large lumps of rock had been dislodged from the hanging wall of the stopes above and had come crashing down onto the floor of the level below.
Gold is where you find it
Tamarmole
10 years ago
"Ty Gwyn" wrote:

Of all the tremors that have occured in the UK in the last 100 yrs or so,have there been any records that showed effects on Working Mines?



There was a small quake somewhere off Lundy a few years ago which shook my windows in Calstock in South East Cornwall. The following day we did a more than usually thorough inspection of the George & Charlotte and found no damage whatsoever.

Coincidently last week I came across a very nice hand written letter dating from the 1750s. It was written by John Nancarrow of Great Work mine to the Rev. William Borlase and gave details of an earthquake as experienced by miners. As I was chasing something else at the time I only gave it a cursory glance. If anyone wants to follow it up it is in the Borlase letter books held by the Morab Library (great place) in Penzance.

There is also an account of an earthquake experienced underground in my Devon Great Consols book.
Peter Burgess
10 years ago
John Mason
10 years ago
"Manicminer" wrote:

I was part of a team that had an exploration license on Clogau a number of years ago and we used to go underground there every weekend. We had 3 earthquakes during that time and on all three occasions large lumps of rock had been dislodged from the hanging wall of the stopes above and had come crashing down onto the floor of the level below.



I recall the stark difference in Clogau before/after the 22nd September 2002 Dudley Earthquake. It was mag 4.7 and I'm glad I wasn't in there when it took place! The old stopes in the Tyn Y Cornel level inbye of the Paraffin Lode junction shed a lot of rock in large pieces.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Dudley_earthquake 
Margot
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10 years ago
Just last week I happened to hear a story, told by a reliable source I'd say, of the 5.4 earthquake in North Wales in '84. It seems that Dinorwic power station was just being built, and there was some watchman of sorts underground there at the time, and it seems he bricked it so badly he had to be stretchered out and taken to hospital. But I didn't hear anything about actual damage! And I know a powerstation is neither a mine nor a cave but it's an underground venue so I thought I'd post it anyway. Poor sod! I can imagine that is a veritably trouser-browning event, damage or no damage!
dwarrowdelf
10 years ago
Paul Sowan's report makes interesting reading: - Maybe a well constructed tunnel/level would probably be safest underground. Not sure i'd want to be in a chamber or collapse cavity during an earthquake though - eg chamber 8E Cwmorthin, and most certainly not chamber 30, and most definitely not the hearthstone mine where I currently help out with digging 😢
'I wonder how many breakfasts, and other meals we have missed inside that nasty clockless, timeless hole?'

'The Hobbit'
J R R Tolkien.
John Lawson
10 years ago
I think the biggest recorded event of an earthquake on mines is that of the Lisbon earthquake. It took place in the middle of the eighteenth century, and its effects were recorded by Derbyshire mine visitors.
No doubt some of our Peak District contributors may fill in some of the details.
Manicminer
10 years ago
"John Mason" wrote:

"Manicminer" wrote:

I was part of a team that had an exploration license on Clogau a number of years ago and we used to go underground there every weekend. We had 3 earthquakes during that time and on all three occasions large lumps of rock had been dislodged from the hanging wall of the stopes above and had come crashing down onto the floor of the level below.



I recall the stark difference in Clogau before/after the 22nd September 2002 Dudley Earthquake. It was mag 4.7 and I'm glad I wasn't in there when it took place! The old stopes in the Tyn Y Cornel level inbye of the Paraffin Lode junction shed a lot of rock in large pieces.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Dudley_earthquake 



I remember seeing that John.

The floor around the hatch for the ladder going downwards by the John Hughes junction was the last thing to go as well as the corner of the stone backfill half way along the John Hughes vein.
Gold is where you find it
Willy Eckerslyke
10 years ago
"dwarrowdelf" wrote:

Not sure i'd want to be in a chamber or collapse cavity during an earthquake though - eg chamber 8E Cwmorthin, and most certainly not chamber 30,


Hehe, chamber 30 is exactly where we'd been 20mins before the quake that Sinker mentions above. We did wonder if we'd disturbed something.

One night in Benallt we heard a couple of weird rumbles that seemed to come from deep beneath us. Turned out it was thunder echoing along the nearby adit!
"The true crimefighter always carries everything he needs in his utility belt, Robin"
dwarrowdelf
10 years ago
"Willy Eckerslyke" wrote:

"dwarrowdelf" wrote:

Not sure i'd want to be in a chamber or collapse cavity during an earthquake though - eg chamber 8E Cwmorthin, and most certainly not chamber 30,


Hehe, chamber 30 is exactly where we'd been 20mins before the quake that Sinker mentions above. We did wonder if we'd disturbed something.

OMG :blink:

'I wonder how many breakfasts, and other meals we have missed inside that nasty clockless, timeless hole?'

'The Hobbit'
J R R Tolkien.
dwarrowdelf
10 years ago
One night in Benallt we heard a couple of weird rumbles that seemed to come from deep beneath us. Turned out it was thunder echoing along the nearby adit!



Was at the end of Rhosydd 9 adit in the chamber when a military jet went over, echoing right down the tunnel. There was a moment of "what on earth (or under it) is that!" or words to that effect, and I just stood there unable to move, gaping down the tunnel, until it dawned on me what it was

Can't even get away from noises like that underground, was my next thought :(

'I wonder how many breakfasts, and other meals we have missed inside that nasty clockless, timeless hole?'

'The Hobbit'
J R R Tolkien.
AR
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10 years ago
"John Lawson" wrote:

I think the biggest recorded event of an earthquake on mines is that of the Lisbon earthquake. It took place in the middle of the eighteenth century, and its effects were recorded by Derbyshire mine visitors.
No doubt some of our Peak District contributors may fill in some of the details.



I don't have the exact details to hand but the Lisbon quake was noticed by the agent at one of the Eyam Edge mines while he was in the mine's reckoning house, Haycliffe if memory serves me correctly.
Follow the horses, Johnny my laddie, follow the horses canny lad-oh!
historytrog
10 years ago
http://places.wishful-thinking.org.uk/DBY/Eyam/History/Leadmines.html 

There were other lesser earthquake events recorded in 1683 and 1704 in the Matlock area that I mention in my forthcoming book.
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