Redwinch
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16 years ago
Not wishing to be a pedantic tw*t (which I am anyway), however this "air box/receiver" as it has been described on more than one occassion would hold more water than air. In all my engineering career I've yet to come across an air receiver made from wood. Extracts from a notebook found near the shaft indicate an air pressure between 45 -80 psi. A flat sided unstayed wooden box would not hold 10. So why am I saying this, when us grey beards have gone mining in the sky, who will know the truth?
the box is probably part of the mamoth pumping system employed to keep the lower workings dry, please accept this in the spirit it is meant and not a point score or a slight but a genuine concern to be factual.

Photograph:

πŸ”—Rampgill-Lead-Mine-User-Album-Image-067[linkphoto]Rampgill-Lead-Mine-User-Album-Image-067[/linkphoto][/link]
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sparty_lea
16 years ago
I must admit to having had some doubts as to its suitability as an air receiver, but I dont really see it as part of a dewatering system either.
Could it have been part of a water feed for the drills maybe?
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AR
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16 years ago
I could imagine it being an air box for a low-pressure ventilation system, but as you rightly point out, wood is not a material you make receivers for compressed air our of unless you want to shower people with splinters!
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Redwinch
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16 years ago
If you look at the various photo's and from personal examination (incidentally this is one of the few "artifacts" that hasn't been vandalised since I first got to it in 1997!) the size of the pipework (4") in and out suggest possibly a pulsation vessel from the air/water pump system used. There are 2 pipes leading off down the horse level which would allow the pumped water to be well clear of the shaft collar, another pipe with a bend appears to be from the shaft itself, ie. a feed from down below? Its unfortunate that no account of the details of the system remain, if there ever was one, unlike the brewery shaft system which was well documented. What we do know is the depth of the shaft, section of strata, pumping system used, winding system, and from notebooks the shift system.
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Morlock
16 years ago
Looking at the other side pic with what appears to be two pipes joining and then going down the shaft (large swept bend), I would take a guess that it's called the "Airbox" as it was used to entrain air into the water prior to it hurtling down the shaft?

Was it part of a system similar to Brewery Shaft?

Redwinch
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16 years ago
The system used to pump water out of the RGS was the exact opposite to the brewery one, ie. The compressed air from brewery shaft was fed down a pipe to the bottom of RGS and allowed to escape up a larger diameter one, the bottom of which was under the water to be pumped out, which in this case was the natress gill level at about 200 ft depth, the resulting ascending of the air carried the water with it. This system was (is) called the mamoth (mamooth (sic)). From contempory accounts the lower level to the natress gill was pumped seperatly and a resevoir was in place at the 200 ft mark to allow the pumping to be done in two lifts. Although extremely simple with no moving parts this system is very wasteful of compressed air, the pumping was (had) to be done when no rock drilling was been carried out. However as the air was "for nothing" compared with compressors driven by steam or electricity, this may account for the use of that particular system. As to the "airbox" it obviously was a container for something, I still dont think air, so what would water of that small capacity be used for? remembering that nearly all pipework is of large diameter, the mystery remains. πŸ™‚

An explanation of this type of pump,also called an air lift pump can be found at
http://www.animatedsoftware.com/pumpglos/air_lift.htm 
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Mr Mike
16 years ago
All very interesting interpretations, who would have though my photo would raise so much air - sorry! πŸ˜‰

Out of interest do you have any photos of the records / book would around the shaft when you first came a cross it?

On another note did you ever come across old miners who remember RGS being open or who could say what is under the rocks fallen on top of it - we think it is wooden beams, going of the noise you get when you work a steel in and thump it ???
Mr Mike www.mineexplorer.org.uk
Morlock
16 years ago
Still guessing, is it a de-airation box to separate air/water.
Redwinch
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16 years ago
"Mr Mike" wrote:

All very interesting interpretations, who would have though my photo would raise so much air - sorry! πŸ˜‰

Out of interest do you have any photos of the records / book would around the shaft when you first came a cross it?

On another note did you ever come across old miners who remember RGS being open or who could say what is under the rocks fallen on top of it - we think it is wooden beams, going of the noise you get when you work a steel in and thump it ???



On the contrary, discussion is the way forward, so dont apologise,

Some photos of the pages still readable exist, the book was so water logged as to render it nearly useless, will post some more on the document page.

As to the blockage, the shaft was worked to the 200 ft depth, it wont be blocked completly to that depth, fancy a dig?
The only person(s) I personally knew who had knowledge of the shaft were Eric Richardson and Arthur Raistrick, both long dead.

Regards Ian
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Morlock
16 years ago
A further thought, does the figure of 45-80 PSI refer to the airlift operating pressure, not any pressure that may be in the airbox?

More food for thought is that this type of pump (in it's simple form) requires a sump at least 40% of the pumped head!
Redwinch
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16 years ago
The pressure referred to was recorded at the shaft top by the engineman on a half hourly basis, it could have been to record when he was pumping or winding, remember that the air supply was not just for the RGS, it was piped all around the mine(s). Could it have been for his own record when he was UNABLE to work through lack of suitable air pressure? and called to account by his boss(es). As to the 40+ % there was plenty of space beneath to allow for that, total shaft depth was over 400 ft, second deepest on alston moor ?
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Morlock
16 years ago
"Redwinch" wrote:

remember that the air supply was not just for the RGS, it was piped all around the mine(s). Could it have been for his own record when he was UNABLE to work through lack of suitable air pressure? and called to account by his boss(es).quote]

A lot more to this than meets the eye!
I suppose as the air was also used for winding that the pressure would have had a direct influence on the load wound?
Seems logical that the operator would have to account for performance.

Was the winder a balanced two cage set-up?

Redwinch
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16 years ago
All I know is that there were 2 cages in the shaft, some things we will never know, however they still arouse interest

:confused:
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Morlock
16 years ago
Yep, the more I look at the pipework pics, the more possibilities.

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