Hi all, just a note aimed at all the caving, mining and climbing clubs that might have huts.
The government announced a £10,000 grant for all "businesses" to help them with ongoing costs during the current lockdown.
The defenition for a business is that you have a business rates account at the district council or local authority, and are in recipt of rural rates relief. I believe this applies even if you get 100% relief as I know most Welsh clubs do. That is to my knowledge, pretty much every caving and climbing club with a hut.
The legislation appears to be UK wide although Wales are yet to get the claims form online.
I am aware of at least 3 UK caving clubs already in reciept of the money and a lot more have applied. This note is just to let anybody know who may be in a club with a hut that I'm not aware of.
I'm aware that there are a load of climbing huts, partiularly in Wales and the Lake District that I don't know, but may be able to claim this money.
I wouldn't want any outdoor club to miss out on a free grant from the government, especially when nobody is able to use the huts, so no income, but still with all the outgoings.

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Hi les,

Have successfully applied, pretty straightforward. Money in the account, but we did apply not long after the start of April.

Al,
TSG treasurer (Castleton based caving club)

Hi Al
Wessex also applied and money is in the bank.
As you say, straight forward and easy form.
I just don't want anybody in the caving/outdoor world to miss out on free money from the government... :thumbup:

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Most caving and climbing huts are businesses.
They let their buildings out to fee paying guests so this makes them hostels. At the moment they are closed so losing income, but still have outgoing costs. This type of cheap accommodation will dissapear if these clubs cannot afford to run their huts to the benefit of all those that use them.
There is lots of help out there for all sorts of businesses that might be hit by Covid-19, particullarly if they are leisure based.
It's not perfect but at least it's something. I'm sorry you have yet to find any help for your business, but that's not a reason to prevent others accessing help.

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It's not free money from the government it's free money from the taxpayer.

Hi Al

I just don't want anybody in the caving/outdoor world to miss out on free money from the government... :thumbup:

Is it just me or is this all a bit "unseemly" and not inkeeping with the current mood....trousering £10k just because its there? That would pay for a few masks. Or a kidney machine. Couple of incubators....

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Or a Wessex Cave Club Ceilidh or a round of public school boy caving songs...

Hi Al

I just don't want anybody in the caving/outdoor world to miss out on free money from the government... :thumbup:

Is it just me or is this all a bit "unseemly" and not inkeeping with the current mood....trousering £10k just because its there? That would pay for a few masks. Or a kidney machine. Couple of incubators....

Nope!... Its not just you. 😠

If a club is run properly and openly, it's income will likely end up in the community through the activities it does, whether running and maintaining a hostel, arranging activities for the public, paying for professional services, or whatever. A properly constituted club will not be distributing money to individual members, and should not be simply sticking it in a bank account with no plans to spend it eventually. The rights and wrongs of receiving money that might buy medical equipment might be a valid point, but not accepting the money is unlikely to make someone think "look at this spare money we seem to have let's buy a ventilator".

My club will not be receiving a high 4-figure sum income this year due to not being able to run it's usual schedule of public-facing activities. And we are scheduled to have a low 5-figure bill to pay some time in connection with those activities. A grant would be "useful" and may help us pay for some very useful mine-related work by people who make a living doing so.

"Benefit the community".
https://darknessbelow.co.uk/event-wessex-cave-club-ceilidh/ 

"Open to cavers".

Taking from the community to benefit a privileged self-interest group more accurately.

What we do is a pastime. Where we choose to do it is a pastime. If a few people get together and form a club and stay together communally, it’s still a pastime. If they then rent the club out to others to save themselves personal costs, its not a business, its a a subsidised pastime. In other words, similar to lockdown talk, non essential.

Not withstanding freelancers who may be benefiting financially from such club setups, that’s what the relevant Gov support is really there for.

As such, therefore, then!

The TSG brings in hundreds of visitors a year to Castleton, most of whom go caving there and spend money at the local shops and pubs. We've worked with the Parish Council, the local history group and the WI, as well as helping all the showcaves, to try and improve our relations with the village above and beyond what we need to.

Additionally, we have to maintain the fabric of the building according to local legal requirements as we're right in the centre of the village rather than in the middle of nowhere, and that can get expensive - like over £7K last year for two new 'approved' windows. It's likely that most of our modest annual income from guest fees will now not happen for most (if not all) of this year, and so we have no way to begin recouping against these essential costs until we can re-open, and we'll likely be a year behind. So I don't feel guilty about us receiving the money at all - we all work our asses off for free to keep the place going.

I'm also a freelance business not receiving any money from the government, and I currently have no work as my current job was postponed indefinitely due to coronavirus - but if my caving club goes under then I have nothing to do in my spare time either.

And if I end up homeless due to the recession, at least I can crash there for a few nights :zzz:

Quite right PWhole - don't let anyone make you feel guilty about it. :thumbsup:

Quite right PWhole - don't let anyone make you feel guilty about it. :thumbsup:

The suggestion is that as mere taxpayers it is not our position to care?

A Freemasons Lodge or Conservative Club could also make similar claims about benefiting the community yet I doubt few here would shout out about how they can get "£££Free Money£££". At least in their favour their primary purpose isn't to serve as cheap holiday homes for their members...

As a taxpayer myself, I have no problem with clubs being used as channels for funding going to trades that are going to need income to survive. Which are then in turn in a position to contribute to the UK economy. Caving and mine-exploration is a hobby activity. But the clubs involved are often far more than groups of people who like to get muddy and drink beer. To think of cavers underground as the be all and end all of what we do is being a bit blinkered.

I can think of numerous societies in our little world that are in effect businesses running museums, show mines, and the like. Never mind the hostels and huts. There is far more that we as a "hobby community" do.

Quite right PWhole - don't let anyone make you feel guilty about it. :thumbsup:

No guilt there that's for sure. It stinks. Wrong time. Wrong mood. Wrong money. End of.

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A bit of perspective - £10000 is the maximum 4-months furlough payment for one person.