Jeff
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15 years ago
Reply to JRarchMAR12.


Unfortunately this is not my area of expertise but I will try to help...as with things this old descriptions can get distorted with time.

It is often written that the price of graphite rocketed once it started to be used by the military for moulds when casting cannon balls. I am not aware of anyone who has actually seen documentary evidence about home/export figures to the military of graphite even though it obviously happened.

http://www.keswickminingmuseum.co.uk/ 
[email protected]
He produced a book on the graphite mine..Seathwaite Wad, although it is more a history of the mine I know he had access to a large archive of documents in Dorset UK.

The mine land is owned by the National Trust and they also now own Kingston Lacy House in Dorset which was the residence of the Bank's family...who owned the mine for many years. Here is a link to an interesting National Trust PDF file about the mine that may be of interest to you.
http://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/main/w-review01_03.pdf 

I would suggest that the large archive could be based at Kingston Lacy House in Dorset. Contacting the National Trust in Dorset may be the best route for you to get documentery evidence.

Hope this help.

Jeff
Captain Scarlet
15 years ago
"Jeff" wrote:



http://www.keswickminingmuseum.co.uk/ 
[email protected]
He produced a book on the graphite mine..

Jeff



Ian is better contacted on [email protected]


😉 😉
STANDBY FOR ACTION!!!!...
Monty Stubble
15 years ago
The word pencil comes from the Latin word penicillus which means "little tail". The graphite found at Borrowdale was called plumbago which means 'acts like lead' (the Latin for lead being plumbum which also makes a mark on paper). This is why we still call them pencil leads.

The deposit at Borrowdale is the purest form of graphite ever found although impure deposits exist elsewhere. Graphite was prized throughout Europe (and by extension the world) as an artists drawing material and was used raw - intially sawn into sticks and then wrapped in string or sheepskin and then later sandwiched between two pieces of wood to make a pencil.

Artists were the main users of pencils as they were so expensive relative to a cheap goose feather pen. People didn't generally use pencils to write with.

Mixing inferior graphites with other substances had been tried before, notably by the Germans in the 17th century who tried graphite, sulphur and antimony. They weren't much good. During the Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars Britain obviously stopped the export of graphite to France and hence to most of Europe. In steps French Army Officer and failed balloonist Nicolas-Jacques Conté who managed to mix graphite and clay, bake it in an oven and produce the pencil lead we know today.

I think the last pure graphite pencils were made around the 1860's before Conté's method became universal.
The finest workers in stone are not copper or steel tools, but the gentle touches of air and water working at their leisure with a liberal allowance of time.
Henry David Thoreau
JRarchMAR12
15 years ago
Thanks for the info, Graigfawr. Do you have the source for your information available?

Chances of it being used at this early date for marking animals are slim, since there are very few domestic animals in Jamestown during this period. The colonist are starving right before they backfill the well in which we found the pieces of graphite. According to our Curator, most of the pieces we find are marking stones, so the raw form of the graphite...pretty much in the same form it was removed in.

Do you know the earliest time in which they figured out its lubricant properties?

Thanks again! This is has been very useful.

-JRarchMAR12
[/i]MAR[i]
JRarchMAR12
15 years ago
Jeff,

Thanks so much for the information and contacts. This will be very useful to me. Even if I find that the graphite was never used as a lubricant at Jamestown during that early period, it has taught me a lot about the mining and the trade. I would love to see the mine and am interested in how we would source the graphite we have to prove scientifically that our graphite is connected to Seathwaite. Have any idea on the process of sourcing graphite? I plan to call on our contacts at the Smithsonian for that soon enough.

I did contact the Keswick Mining Museum a few weeks ago, but have not heard back from them. I will try to reach Ian Tyler directly. I am having a hard time finding a copy of his book in this country. (The Metropolitan Museum of Art in New York is the only place that lists it) Hopefully, they still have one at Keswick. We would like to have one on file here at Jamestown, since we find ourselves related through the graphite.

I had seen the PDF and information on the Banks family. It must have been quite an operation.

Thanks again.

-JRarchMAR12
[/i]MAR[i]
Jeff
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15 years ago
Reply to JRarchMAR12

One of the scientist contacted me recently to let me know that the third technical paper on the graphite mine is due out shortly. When I get it I will get back to him (as I always have questions) and ask if there is a "signature" to graphite that can link it to a specific mine. Carbon Isotope signatures were used to prove that the source carbon for the graphite originated from the underlying mudstone rocks so it may be possible.
If anyone knows it will be these people, there knowledge is unbelievable.
I'll also tell him of the find at Jamestown.

On a different theme it may be worth mentioning that in that time period graphite was used as a popular treatment for "colic."

Jeff
Graigfawr
15 years ago
"JRarchMAR12" wrote:

Thanks for the info, Graigfawr. Do you have the source for your information available?

Chances of it being used at this early date for marking animals are slim, since there are very few domestic animals in Jamestown during this period. The colonist are starving right before they backfill the well in which we found the pieces of graphite. According to our Curator, most of the pieces we find are marking stones, so the raw form of the graphite...pretty much in the same form it was removed in.

Do you know the earliest time in which they figured out its lubricant properties?

Thanks again! This is has been very useful.

-JRarchMAR12



Apologies - I overlooked your posting here.

The oft-repeated (but, I suspect, unverifiable) story seems to be that the Keswick deposit was first found by shepherds following a tree toppling in a storm / being struck by lightening and exposing lumps of graphite amongst its roots, and that the shepherds used this useful material to mark sheep until a well-informed gentleman saw what they were using and recognised it as graphite. This story is repeated in various popular works describing the deposit. No reference avialable I'm sorry, but I've certainly read it more than once. Whilst its plausible, it is hadrly verifiable. Someone with local knowledge of the deposit may be able to trace the occurrence of this story (or varients) back though Victorian and eighteenth century 'travels' and early guidebooks to the Lake District.

The earliest significant UK reference I have to graphite is in A.Rees 'The Cyclopaedia; or Universal Dictionary of Arts, Sciences and Literature', 39 vols, London, 1802-20, extracts pub. in 'Rees's manufacturing Industry (1819-20): a selection from 'The Cyclopaedia; or Universal Dictionary of Arts, Sciences and Literature', 5 vols, N.Cossons, ed, Newton Abbot, 1972 [all comments in square brackets are mine]:

"Plumbago ... [after a scientific description, and a referecne to a seperate article on pencil making - for which Keswick graphite was stated to be particularly suited, Rees comments] the brilliant charcoal of certain vegetable substances, more especially when formed by distillation in close vessels, possesses all the characteristics of plumbago: and the charcoal of animal substances, possesses characters still more pecularily resembling it ... [maybe you 'graphite' might be possibly actually be distilled plant or animal charcoal?]. This mineral is found in ... England, Scotland [Ayrshire is mentioned elsewhere], France, Spain, Germany, America [where???], &c. ... it is sometimes used to lubricate machinery instead of oil [my surmise that its use as alubricant came in the C19 is clearly incorrect] and to protect iron from rust [maybe to protect prestiege armour?]. The hearths and plates [i.e. fire-backs?] of chimnies and other utensils [fire-irons, not utensils that were used to cook or eat food], which appear very bright. owe their colour to plumbago. For this purpose Homburg long ago, viz. in 1699 [Rees was punctiluous in referencing material he obtained from earlier books; this reference does not mean that Homburg invented this use of graphite, just that this was the earliest direction found by Rees], directed 8lbs of hog's lard to be melted with a small quantity of water, with the addition of 4oz of camphor. When this last is used, the mixture is taken from the fire; and while it is yet hot, a small qunatity of plumbago is added to give it a leaden colour. When this is to be applied, the utensils must be heated to such a degree, that the hand can scarcely bear to touch them. In this state the composition must be rubbed on them, and afterwards wiped when the piece is dry [is this a plausible use for plumbago in the early C17 colonies?]. ... It is ... used to make razor strops [must have been a barber-surgeon in the colony?]. When kneaded with clay it makes excellent crucibles."

This article raises a number of potentially plausible uses for plumbago in the early C17, though how likely those uses were in early colonial America I leave to you to determine. The spread of occurrences of poorer grade graphite raises the probability that Keswick may not have been the origin of your finds. Clearly a chemical signature would be most desirable.

Do keep Aditnow informed on any progress!
JRarchMAR12
15 years ago
This is useful information. We fairly sure on the graphite, we have beeing some of the purest. Of course, we would have to find a way to source it to be sure. We are in the process of trying to source one of the Archaeology Project's biggest findings: A slate writing tablet with carvings from the late C16 and early C17. News on that found here:

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/01/100113-jamestown-tablet-slate-american-rosetta-stone/ 

Information about Jamestown Rediscovery found here:

http://www.preservationvirginia.org/rediscovery/page.php?page_id=1 

We did have an article about some of the graphite we found a couple of years ago for the local newspaper. I'll see if I can find a link for that, too.

I am waiting to get my hands on some sources about the Borrowdale mine or the Company of Mines Royal's involvement in graphite. 😎
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Jeff
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15 years ago
Reply and information for JRarchMAR12.


In a previous mail I mentioned getting in touch with one of the Spanish scientists from the Department of Crystallography and Mineralogy, Complutense University, Madrid who studied the mine in great detail. I have been in touch with him recently and have enclosed some of that communication below which you may find interesting.

If you have any photos, especially the "chicken egg" size piece that you can post here it would be useful and could be forwarded...see enclosed email below.

I don't know what the situation is with your group as far as supplying "valuable" archeological artifacts for analysis to far flung places so until then I will leave it at that. I suppose it depends on how important it is to know conclusively it's origin. All I can say is these scientist are experts on this graphite deposit and appear to be willing to help.
Anyway below is the email.

Jeff

email reply.
Hi Jeff
It is really interesting the finding of graphite in the archeological settlement of Virginia. It seems very reasonable to infer that such graphite came from Borrowdale. By that time, the only mine known (to my knowledge) was that at Seathwaite. On the other hand, the discovery of the "egg-shaped" graphite sample could confirm such an assumption, as rounded nodules (that is, "eggs") are a very distinctive feature of the deposit.

Borrowdale graphite is unique in many aspects, and thus further information on the findings would be relevant. For instance, is there any rock fragment associated with the graphite? The petrography of such rocks (mineral associations) could prove the provenance. It would be great if we could get pictures (I realize that getting the samples should be bureaucratically very difficult) of some of the findings (particularly the "egg-shaped" graphite). Of course, some graphite morphologies are unique to the Borrowdale deposit, but the study of such morphologies involves destructive methods of analysis. Even the isotopic composition could help and this just need some miligrams of graphite...

I hope this helps.

Best regards.

JRarchMAR12
11 years ago
Jeff,

All these years later, I have picked up the research of graphite here at the Jamestown Colony with new enthusiasm. We have about 100 grams (45 pieces) of the graphite and I have received a sample of some graphite on a host stone taken from the mine during your trip with ?Luque del Villar. This was sent to me from Jamie Lund at the National Trust. I assume that the email correspondence you have listed for me on this forum from 2010 is from Luque? I am very interested in talking with him about some carbon isotope testing (or anything else he may suggest) on how to source our graphite back to the Borrowdale Mine. I am not a trained geologist, so I would need some help interpreting any results of these tests.

Hopefully, you still check in with this forum from time to time.

Thanks,
Mary Anna
[/i]MAR[i]
Jeff
  • Jeff
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11 years ago
Hello Mary Anna.

I am always looking out for topics to do with the Graphite Mine!

The first thing to say is that this sort of research is extremely complicated and probably only a handful of people have that expertise to not only carry out but more importantly "interpret" the data which would include the crystal morphology, petrography of any accompanying rock as well as the isotopic data. Javier and his team at the University of Madrid are without doubt the leading experts.

Back in 2010 when it was first mentioned about Jamestown I asked Javier for his opinion. The reply is enclosed again below:

It is really interesting the finding of graphite in the archeological settlement of Virginia. It seems very reasonable to infer that such graphite came from Borrowdale. By that time, the only mine known (to my knowledge) was that at Seathwaite. On the other hand, the discovery of the "egg-shaped" graphite sample could confirm such an assumption, as rounded nodules (that is, "eggs") are a very distinctive feature of the deposit.

Borrowdale graphite is unique in many aspects, and thus further information on the findings would be relevant. For instance, is there any rock fragment associated with graphite? The petrography of such rocks (mineral associations) could prove the provenance. It would be great if we could get pictures (I realize that getting the samples should be bureaucratically very difficult) of some of the findings (particularly the "egg-shaped" graphite). Of course, some graphite morphologies are unique to the Borrowdale deposit, but the study of such morphologies involves destructive methods of analysis. Even the isotopic composition could help and this just need some miligrams of graphite...

I hope this helps.

Best regards,

Javier

It is...though not what you would like to hear, hard to imagine someone other than the Spanish scientist being able to interpret the data...my opinion only. It does appear that only tiny amounts for sampling would be needed though this would obviously be traumatic with such a rare find.

It would certainly be quite something to find out if the Graphite originated from this unique mine.

I will send him an email with your comments and see if he is happy for me to pass on his details to you. This may take a while as I only have his University email.

The article about the visit has been updated a few times and may help with the techniques and background info. It's in the
Borrowdale (Plumbago, Wad) Graphite Mine (United Kingdom) page.

That's all I can think off for now. Keep in touch.

Jeff.



JRarchMAR12
11 years ago
Thank you so much for the info, Jeff. There seems to be so much more information out there now than 4 years ago because of the interest in graphite in the global market. I do a little investing and have seen more articles on the lower quality graphite exported from China and Canada.

I think the possibility of Borrowdale graphite being used at Jamestown for something besides just pencils is a good one. It may have only been used here a couple of years, though. I'm on the trail of other candidate colonies with the mineral. I wrote a short article for our donor newsletter that includes some pictures. It isn't published on our website, yet, but hopefully the link will work:

http://www.historicjamestowne.org/newsletter/may14/jamestown_graphite.php 

Let me know if the link works or not. I probably have some of the information incorrect in terms of the geology. As I said, I'm new to the geology side of things. There is a picture of four nodules that came from a cellar we found for a building dated 1607-1610. Everyone has commented on what a beautiful mineral it is. I would love to get some grant/scholarship money to further investigate. My next step is the Southeastern Archaeology Conference in South Carolina this November. Looking forward to getting some feedback from other archaeologists in our region.
[/i]MAR[i]
Jeff
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11 years ago
Hi Mary.

Good to hear from you.
A lot of interesting information in you mail.

Your write-up on the graphite is excellent and very informative. It would be a good piece of information on the website.

The only sentence that would be better changed for accuracy is:- Graphite is a form of carbon that mineralizes in metamorphosed sedimentary rocks.

The graphite at Seathwaite occurred in “Volcanic Rocks” not sedimentary rocks which is why it is so rare and unique. It is the only occurrence with economical amounts and only one of two none to occur in volcanic rocks…the other is in Spain. The origin of the carbon ie. organic material contained within the underlying mudstones and sandstones is also rare.

The pieces of graphite in the photo look very similar to graphite from Seathwaite, though that is not conclusive evidence of course.

If the origins of the graphite can be scientifically identified it would be a very important piece of history on both sides of the pond!

I will be sending an email to Javier later today. The speed of his reply will depend on whether he his on vacation or not but I know he will reply when he can. I will include your article with the photos which I'm sure he will find interesting.

All for now.

Jeff




Jeff
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11 years ago
Mary Anna.

Javier Luque has sent me a short email acknowledgement from a portable device while on vacation.

He will reply in a couple of weeks.

Jeff
JRarchMAR12
11 years ago
Jeff,

Thanks so much for passing on the info. You have been super helpful. I'm excited at the prospect of working with him and his team.

Mary Anna
[/i]MAR[i]
Jeff
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11 years ago
Hi Mary Anne.

I have received an email from Javier. It appears there is no "smoking gun" as it were to determine for certain the origin of the graphite.

This is obviously very complicated science and these people only work on provable science not speculation like the rest of us.

The best chance seems to be if there were samples containing wall rock (like the sample from Jamie Lund...though I doubt you have any like that.

Enclosed is his reply:

Hi Jeff,

I am back at my office, so I can give a detailed answer to your message about graphite at Jamestown.

I read the article of Mary Anna and looked over the photo. The pieces of graphite shown in the photo are just pieces of graphite. I cannot see any evidence of provenance from the Seathwaite mine. The search for any evidence on its origin is complicated (probably impossible, I must say). The graphite from Borrowdale has some unique textural characteristics as we described in our studies, but these can only be observed on polished samples. This involves the “destruction” of the sample, and I infer that this should be avoided. In addition, we could found none of these particular characteristics in a given sample. So, we must discard this approach.

Carbon isotope geochemistry is a better technique to preserve the integrity of the samples as only a minor amount of graphite is needed. However, the isotopic value is not a conclusive evidence to establish the origin of graphite. As described in our papers, there is a large range of carbon isotope values for the Borrowdale graphite. In addition, its isotopic ratio is that of biogenically-derived carbon, a common feature of many graphite occurrences around the world (including some graphite deposits from North America – I can submit a couple of recent papers if necessary –).

So, I am sorry to say this, but at the present I cannot envisage a method for the determination of the precise origin of the graphite found at Jamestown. Among the graphite from Jamestown, is there any sample containing parts of the enclosing rock? This would help, as the Borrowdale graphite is the only known occurrence associated with andesite rocks.

I hope this helps.

Best regards,

Javier

I'm sorry it's unfortunately not what we want to hear but his email does show how extremely technical the subject is.

I will send you a private email with his contact details shortly. He is quite happy for you to contact him.

Jeff



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