Boy Engineer
10 years ago
Quote:

I didn't notice any bobs


Presume there may have been a few after Demelza's dress came off, but the BBC spared our blushes in that regard.
Roy Morton
10 years ago
The ladder thing made me smile too. Wooden sides and iron rungs were the traditional construction in Cornish mines. In old copper mines the iron rungs would dissolve wheras the wooden sides would pickle and be preserved.
I'll see if I can load a few photos later with some good examples.
"You Chinese think of everything!"
"But I''m not Chinese!"
"Then you must have forgotten something!"
royfellows
10 years ago
Same in lead mines Roy, think its the low ph of the water.

Ladders up to Llanrwst from Parc 2 where suspended by a tape round a corroded rung until I overhauled it. When it was freed the rung was right through!
I knocked it out and replaced it with allthread.
My avatar is a poor likeness.
AR
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10 years ago
I don't think it's so much low pH but more that metals like lead, copper and zince will be more soluble in acidic water, and act as an effective antimicrobial/antifungal to prevent the timber rotting.
Follow the horses, Johnny my laddie, follow the horses canny lad-oh!
Roy Morton
10 years ago
The cuprous water has a pretty harsh effect on the iron rungs, but leaves the timber staves in tip top condition.
Pickled in natural Cuprinol, the timber will probably last for centuries. These ladders date from the first few years of the 20th century, and much of the timber is as sound as when it was installed, in fact, sound enough for us to have nailed battens to, to gain access to other levels.

The first shot shows a ladder in the shaft with most of its rungs missing.

The other shots are of a ladder which had fallen down and is slowly being transformed into copper. Two stages are clearly visible; the secondary copper mineral deposition and a then a concentrated stage of metallic copper.

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"You Chinese think of everything!"
"But I''m not Chinese!"
"Then you must have forgotten something!"
Alasdair Neill
10 years ago
Somewhere I have a photo of what happened to an alloy extension ladder left in Parys Mine in no time atal - easiest way to take it out again is to leave it a few weeks and let it dissolve into lots of small pieces.
Anywhere on the coast in Cornwall with a draught will have the added effect of salt laden air being drawn through.
John Lawson
10 years ago
The iron rungs of ladders would be replaced by copper, in water carrying copper ions.
Once this has happened the rate of rusting will increase dramatically, as the, iron's electrons are passed to the copper deposited, and eventualy end up as iron hydrated oxides.
As has already been stated, both copper and zinc ions kill the microorganisms, that rot wood, acting as a natural fungicide.

exspelio
10 years ago
"Alasdair Neill" wrote:

Somewhere I have a photo of what happened to an alloy extension ladder left in Parys Mine in no time atal - easiest way to take it out again is to leave it a few weeks and let it dissolve into lots of small pieces.
Anywhere on the coast in Cornwall with a draught will have the added effect of salt laden air being drawn through.



This suggests a high pH, (alkali) - would totally destroy ally, don't try cleaning ally pans with caustic soda !!!!!
Always remember, nature is in charge, get it wrong and it is you who suffers!.
Roy Morton
10 years ago
We left an alloy ladder in Wheal Gorland (copper) and within a month there were 'growths ' of translucent gel up to the size of a hens egg. Copper mines are naturally acidic with ph values down to ph2 in some places, and I've seen rich blue copper sulphate stal (Chalcanthite) 9 inches long in Mount Wellington's deep levels when the mine was at work. Looked very nice when backlit.
There was also green Iron sulphate stal (Melanterite) of a similar length and in curtain formation.
All very very acidic, it would roughen your skin within minutes of contact.
"You Chinese think of everything!"
"But I''m not Chinese!"
"Then you must have forgotten something!"
Tamarmole
10 years ago
I've recently replaced a batch of galvanised steel sleepers in the George & Charlotte. Due to drainage issues they had been in water for a few months and had simply dissolved.
Dolcoathguy
10 years ago
Further to the earlier point
"Would "600 guineas" get a New Boulton / Watt engine?"

Looking up prices in the late 18th century, it would appear that c. £100 would get you a boiler installed, then £500 - £1000 would get you an Engine if you agreed to pay Boulton and Watt a share of the coal saving.(Based on Dolcoath accounts of the period)
So "600 guineas (£630)" would not quite pay for a new engine, boiler, repairs, eqpt in one go.

Ladders - If the are used heavily by miners, how long would a wooden rung ladder last considering all the abrasive grit on their boots? Maybe that is why Iron rungs may have been used.

Is it safe to come out of the bunker yet?
Alasdair Neill
10 years ago
https://ia601006.us.archive.org/19/items/textbookoforesto00fostuoft/textbookoforesto00fostuoft.pdf 
stated that in the UK wooden ladders with iron rungs were most commonly used (as would be expected) but on the Continent oak rungs were common.
Graigfawr
10 years ago
"Dolcoathguy" wrote:

Further to the earlier point
"Would "600 guineas" get a New Boulton / Watt engine?"

Looking up prices in the late 18th century, it would appear that c. £100 would get you a boiler installed, then £500 - £1000 would get you an Engine if you agreed to pay Boulton and Watt a share of the coal saving.(Based on Dolcoath accounts of the period)
So "600 guineas (£630)" would not quite pay for a new engine, boiler, repairs, eqpt in one go.



Looks like they need to introduce some additional dupes, sorry, adventurers into the partnership - maybe some of them Lunnen folk what visit in the summer as they seem to have lots of cash. Better get some nice looking headed paper and an up-country printer to engrave some fancy share certificates. Thank goodness there's no Mining Journal yet to expose the dodgy state of the mine's finances, its lack of ore, and to caution would-be adventurers.
Dolcoathguy
10 years ago
I thought I saw a beam on the Wheal Leisure engine house last night in a far distance shot - Anyone else notice?
Is it safe to come out of the bunker yet?
ant89
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10 years ago
So all mine ladders should be made from gold? ::)
Tony Blair
10 years ago
The subject of ladders is an interesting one. There is a fair amount of talk about solely wooden ladders and I, to the best of my ability can say that almost 100% of the ladders I've bumped into underground have been of the wood/bar construction.

One exception was in Hallenbeagle, where you are crawling through a section and don't look up. If you did look up, as my chum did, there were some exceedingly ancient ladders in situ. I think these were elm and appeared to be a completely different design from the wellington/gorland ones. They were clearly made by a craftsman and I wonder whether they were ladders with a prior life. One of the caveats in that area is that various local miners were working that area above adit up to and including WWI. They could have been later, although these seemed to be ancient to me. All academic now as the whole lot was rudely plugged by Cormac for it's wonderful Biopark which F/A has happened at since. Perhaps they have run out of EU money.

The aluminium gel formed on ally ladders is almost certainly aluminium sulphate formed from the bacteria powered disintegration of pyrite (also resulting in the formation of limonite) and liberation of sulphuric acid.....hence them disintegrating "well fast"
polo
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10 years ago
"Dolcoathguy" wrote:

I thought I saw a beam on the Wheal Leisure engine house last night in a far distance shot - Anyone else notice?



The set didn't include a beam, just the bob. If you saw a beam it was a digital one.
lozz
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10 years ago
We had wooden rung ladders down a gold mine I worked at, if a rock came down either through being loose or blasting the wooden rungs can snap, with iron rungs the downward force of a rock hitting the iron rung can sometimes cause the stiles to split down quite a way.

The above pertains to the ladders in a manway compartment of a mill hole (the stopes ore pass) in a cut and fill stope operation

Lozz.
jhluxton
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10 years ago
Despite some of the technical howlers in the new Poldark series, (There were quite a few in the original series - though one didn't get to see the mines as much in that.) there is bound to be a positive spin off in making more people aware of industrial archaeology and in particular mining history.

There has been a lot of talk of the positive effect of Poldark on the tourist industry and given the popularity of film tourism these days many people will get to wander around Wheel Owles, Botallack etc over the coming months and for some it is bound to trigger a curiosity to find out more and perhaps find a new hobby.

When I watched the original series back in the 70s as a teenager I had already become interested in Cornish mines thanks to holiday visits to the area, however, watching Poldark served to deepen that interest.

I am surprised that this group hasn't recognised the positive impact this series will have on developing an awareness amongst the general public and perhaps out of the 8 million or so viewers generate some more mining enthusiasts.

John
www.jhluxton.com - Transport, Industrial Archaeology Photography and More
https://www.flickr.com/photos/jhluxton/  - my Flickr Photostream
Morrisman
10 years ago
the "Poldark Effect" is already taking effect. I'm at East Pool Mine and visitors are already saying they are visiting because they want to see where they were filming and get an idea of what mining life was really like. Got to be good for bringing finance into the county, which is desperately needed the way County Council wastes it.

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